🇬🇧What a day! Stability tests with @naval_architect of @venturiprojects to understand better the “Verdhugo” scow bow design, in order to perform better in the Mini Transat 2025, the singlehanded Atlantic crossing without. PAPILLON. 80333; -92. Watch Video. Definitely a planing hull, slightly blunt at the front, with a small start of a keel, but the exit at the transom is ruler flat. Discussion in 'Sailboats' started by ThereIsNoBox, Feb 22, 2012. and view of individual users. (3) Simple shape so relatively easy and cheap to build and fit out the hull. The two pictures on the left show the typical Darroch bow, rather elegantly curved chine. This is because the wind is pushing the boat sideways. Contact the Australian Moth class for more information. Thursday, September 08, 2011. See more ideas about boat, boat design, small boats. Interesting "scow bow" on an old Route de Rhum competitor "Ovum" dsigned, Jun 8, 2018, in forum: Sailboats. 1. 01111. Boat Design Net. With over 110 fleets and well-attended regional and national regattas, the MC class is one of the most active one-design classes in the U. Both the MOORING and the TRAILING-MOORING (T-M) styles cover the entire boat deck - from the bow to the aft end, around stays, and around the mast. Classic Jeanneau styling in an extremely modern yacht. The whole idea is a kind of joke. It works on the many scow one-design classes and even the old, sedate, CCA rule had Hoot Mon, a scowlike yawl with a successful race record. These types of bows have been shown to be much. So a 40' pontoon can carry about 8 tons, which isn't especially impressive, so let's add a third toon and she's now able to carry just a smidge over 12 tons. O. 0 Conventional Bow. As a consequence of this, the A scow is the highest rated centerboard boat according to the US Portsmouth yardstick numbers. Stability tests with @naval_architect of @venturiprojects to understand better the “Verdhugo” scow bow. Once your mast is stepped into position, take a 50’-long steel. 50 racer. The voluminous bow of scow, combined with a marotte on the front will not fail to shock the most conservative. In 15 knot winds and moderate wind waves, the motion of the bow against the horizon kept catching my eye – like something didn’t compute. com. This is the most interesting new cruising sailboat design I’ve seen in a long time. Dolfiman Jun 10, 2018. From a basic trailerable tri L26', we then have some beam at the Lwl fore perpendicular like with a bow scow. The key in design for this light of a hull is to spread the concentrated loads out over a larger area, the doubler to thicken a length of the. Just looking for an opinion if you think this type of hull would actually sail. 4. When the Mini Transat sent out a media release about some new designs for this year's race, we looked at the ugly scow bow in the. It was inevitable that a builder would jump on the scow bow for a family cruising boat. Is there an optimum angle for a scow front end? This houseboat will operate in an inland. Glenn Edwards 13,800 CY 2006 2. Hmm, a vessel that would legitimately be categorized as a scow that had enough freeboard to provide a get-down-inside-it cockpit would be an interesting craft in an 18 foot incarnation. Discussion in 'Sailboats' started by Donald B, Feb 27, 2017. Owen Clarke, working with Peter Hobson Design (PHD) and PURE Engineering have come up with the fastest, most versatile Class40 drawn to date. . Bolger's first boat design. Sailboat bow design will Speeding up the job technique fails to need significantly. 26/03/2015. . They were predominant between the 16th and 20th centuries, and modern ships' badges fulfil a similar role. 01:07 Grab the spinnaker halyard hanging from the front of the mast. . Sam Manuard The concept behind making scows is to avoid sinking the bow underwater. This new model has revolutionized cruising: she is the first of the next generation (8th generation) Sun Odyssey's and features inclined "walk around" Side Decks for ease of movement from twin helms directly forward to the bow! Full Length Chine Hull with NEW "Scow Bow" design. The forestay is attached well aft of the boat's bow. e. The Jeanneau 410 features the revolutionary walk around decks and new “scow bow” hull form that have been so popular with sailors around the world on its larger siblings like the 440 and 490. Currently in build at Berkeley Marine Center, as conceived by a notable client, Barry Spanier, and drawn by a notable designer, Jim Antrim. Since then, the MC class has grown to be one of the top one-design sailboat racing classes in North America. Discussion in 'Boat Design' started by buzzman, Nov 24, 2021. The K-159 sank with no warning, sending 800kg (1,760lb) of spent uranium fuel to the seafloor beneath. Tom. Scows are fantastic boats; I wish we still had ours. 26/03/2015. Dimensions for an exemplary boat could be 7m length, 3,5m width, daggerboards 80 cm deep. I think splitting it in half has been done on some of the linked articles; then at least the effects are lessened. Search . Sail SCOW 37 The Scow, a great idea! According to Gildas Plessis who is the architect, the scow hull "is a great idea. Full Deck Cover +$315. Discussion in 'Sailboats' started by captainjo, Mar 29, 2016. Scow Bow's Ingenious Design The Favorite Of Class 40 11-02-2022, 10:40 AM The biggest category in the race, Class40 stands out too with many new wide-bowed. 5 is the latest generation series production Classe Mini 6. Box 26 . Some scow designs may also include a. 20 m x Beam 1. Double cockpit. TT SCOW | THOMAS TISON YACHT DESIGN & ENGINEERING. It shifted my focus from naval engineering to naval architecture. In some ways, something like a 25 foot scow is often simply a 28 foot boat with the bow chopped off; in fact in some small boat classes where there was a length. Crosscall is a great example of innovative yacht design, featuring. It is significant, I think, that Spanier, a lifelong sailmaker. Bottom Cover +$295. Full wave piercing is fine for WPing, if you don't mind lots of green water over the bow and rest of boat. Interesting "scow bow" on an old Route de Rhum competitor "Ovum" dsigned, Jun 8, 2018, in forum: Sailboats. A miniature cat boat of traditional design given modern construction techniques. en scow. It's being skippered by Giancarlo Pedote and is named Prysmian. Design a small sailboat with scow bow for blue water sailing. Sleeker, lighter, with more sail area and more volume in the bow for the master cabin than its predecessor, the new Oceanis 34. Interesting "scow bow" on an old Route de Rhum competitor "Ovum" dsigned, Jun 8, 2018, in forum: Sailboats. ADS. Flat-bottomed and slab-sided, they were generally built in 14′, 16′, or 18′ lengths, and could be built as either skiffs or. A scow for performance and comfort . Dolfiman Jun 10,. Designed by Christophe Couton, a professional. Scow with a hint of bow? Having studied the thread From Classic Bow to Scow Bow by @Dolfiman, and the post Latest Evolutions and Revolution in the Class40 by François. The etymology of the word is. 80333°N 92. wht. The spoon bow helps, but the jib needs to be designed (and sailed) to be neutral through puffs, while the hull is neutral over a wide range of speeds in steady state sailing. 2017 Eastern Class E Scow Association Championship Regatta Final Cumulative Results: Select to view a specific Class: Bow: Sail Number: Yacht Name: Yacht Design: Skipper/Crew: Race 1: Race 2: Race 3: Race 4: Race 5: Race 6: Race 7: T O: Total: Championship Regatta Racing: One Design Division: E Scow: 1. The A Scow is a racing sailboat, with the early versions built from wood and the more recent ones built predominantly of fiberglass. BATAAN said:. Philip C. Sam Manuard. This model shares the speed of a 60’ fast sailing catamaran, the volume of a 50’ monohull or 42’ multihull into a 11,3m full beam scow. Check Out Blue Water Cruisers under $40k. Boat Design Net. Joined: Jul 2007 Posts: 12 Likes: 0, Points: 0, Legacy Rep: 10 Location: Ohio MarkIFC Junior Member. I am currently designing a 14. Steward: 10. Class 40 Scow. Subject: Ship Motions, Theory, Seakeeping, Bulbous Bows JSR March 1970 -----Design of Bulbous Bows Authors: Kracht Subject: Hull Form, Bulbous Bows TR -----From Bulbous Bow to Free-Surface Shock Wave--Trends of 20 Years' Research on Ship Waves at the Tokyo University Tank Authors: Inui Subject: Waves, Resistance, Residual,. See more ideas about boat design, boat, yacht. Scow bow - vs - Wave piercing bow Boat Design Net; raised deck wave-piercing bulbous bow monohull, 60 feet;. 3 min read. It therefore retains an efficient shape when reefed to 35m2, when it can be used close-hauled in. (Ed: just like an upside-down sea kayak would, if pushed from the rear at 20k!) Meanwhile the AXE bow will knife through the water without excessive force either up or down, unless the boat turns sideways, when it will start to add a braking component. There was a layer of fiberglass cloth on both the inside. For a given hull length, one must therefore decide between raising the bow to cope with a wider range of conditions, or keeping the waterline length longer, with an infinity of combinations in between. L66' x b20' x d 5'3" 50 tons GR-38 tons nett. Plumb Bow. In some ways, something like a 25 foot scow is often simply a 28 foot boat with the bow chopped off; in fact in some small boat classes where there was a length restriction and big rigs, designers just used to design a longer boat and then effectively chop the bow off at the desired length. Significant windward (reverse) heel. 5kwh battery may be enough for electric cooking, but bigger battery is more engine range while providing plenty of electric comforts, and a worthwhile upgrade. Replies: 1 Views: 6,712. Custom design your own dodger or see our dodger design page for some potential options that fit you and your sailboat. The MC Sailing Association (MCSA) manages the class. (This term is often very erroneously used to describe any tug with omni-directional propulsion, including ASD tugs). Idle-Along (IA) - is a class of sailing dinghy (or small centreboard yacht) designed by Alf (Unc) Harvey at Petone (Wellington, NZ) in 1927. It’s high quality from bow to stern, featuring a new and improved board system, not to mention stronger, safer and. 1 rig and three crew members on trapeze it can outperform nearly every monohull on the water. An island of freedom I created where most constraints were temporarily removed allowing for a unique, extreme vision. Please Support OCSS Through Patreon! Filming this project and editing video is a lot of work! Anyone who si. Scow bows – more righting moment and better downwind speed. The performance of a scow hull relies on going above the waves as opposed to through the waves. Wheeler 8,000 CY 1981 4. Emmanuel Versace. Random thoughts and rants on boat design, boat building, and other boat bits for those in the 99%. Feb 15, 2016 - Owen Clarke’s involvement with offshore Open 40 / Class 40 racing circuit is as the most prolific yacht designers in this class, outside of France. As the Topper gained popularity in the 1980s, the Minisail disappeared from the scene. Foil Bag - Rudder, Tiller, Daggerboard +$195. The top one is Jane Gifford (67' Darroch 1908) and the bottom one is Thistle (61' Darroch 1894. The scow bow design under sail is remarkable. Other parameters slightly adjusted are the waterline length, theThe Scow-bowed Mini racer. Page 1 of 2 1 2 Next > Joined: Apr 2011. T -18: Showtime: E. The voluminous bow of scow, combined with a marotte on the front will not fail to shock the most conservative. 1. If you were designing a boat from scratch and there were no limitations, would you design it with a vertical bow or a sloped bow?. Notice the boat ‘s bow is pointing toward the mark but the boat is slipping to leeward. In a few days, he will launch his new IMOCA, Charal 2 – this time from the board of Sam Manuard with. 9501 | Customer Service. Skeeta’s foiling system is a culmination of more than 20 years’ development with freely-pivoting foils. The much-anticipated launch of the first two AC75 foiling monohull yachts from the Defender Emirates Team New Zealand and. Developed by Damen Shipyards [9], the Axe Bow features a plumb stem with long, fine lines for the entrance. In the scows the bow instead of cutting through the water will stay high on it. Atop the deck may be a deckhouse and other superstructures, such as a funnel, derrick, or mast. Their squared bows and sterns not only maximized cargo space, but also make scows cheap and easy to build. C foils increase speed and stability to sail flat : there is really no need to heel while cruising ! This model will take you around the world in style in the simplest manner. A straight-edged vertical bow that is perpendicular to the waters is known as a plumb bow. The second is the Fragniere design, a unique transom bow design which was most popular in France before the appearance of the very narrow Duflos and similar designs. This Vessel Boasts A Revolutionary Scow-Bow, Hard Chine Hull And An Ingenious Walk-around. THE MELGES MC SCOW. A conventional bow really gets designed in two parts: under water and above water. The scow bow favored by French naval architect Sam Manuard, designer of Jérémie Beyou’s Charal 2 and Bureau Vallée (the former L’Occitane En Provence skippered by Louis Burton) is one. Beefy loooking keel trunk, seems well built in a precision sort of way. Frog design and making, both in classical and baroque. Dolfiman Jun 10, 2018. Discussion in 'Sailboats' started by dskira, Aug 9, 2009. Having studied the thread From Classic Bow to Scow Bow by @Dolfiman, and the post Latest Evolutions and Revolution in the Class40 by François Chevalier, I am. The Django is rated the same speed as the JPK 1010, Dehler 34 (2016) and XP 33. . Thread by: Terje Dahl , Nov 22, 2022 , 71 replies, in forum: SailboatsThe Reverse bow will simply continue to drive down under. I imagine a 24-ish foot scow with another 2-3 feet added for a wave-piercing bow. sltak, Feb 23, 2011. Stuyvesant 11,140 CY 1982 3. Mayflower. 2. A pram is not a scow. The K-159, a 350ft (107m) November-class attack submarine, was in service from 1963 to 1989. Discussion in 'Sailboats' started by dskira, Aug 9, 2009. America’s Cup: Differences in design. My guess is this bow represents a sweet spot. See Kit Plans for details. Sailing scows flat is often very slow because of the large wetted area and associated drag. Discussion in 'Sailboats' started by dskira, Aug 9, 2009. The 18 ft skiff is currently one of the fastest monohulls on the water. Search from Sailboat Bow stock photos, pictures and royalty-free images from iStock. The much-anticipated launch of the first two AC75 foiling monohull yachts from the Defender Emirates Team New Zealand and. The 410 allows you to walk all the way around the deck from cockpit to bow without ever having to step up or over something. Currently in build at Berkeley Marine Center, as conceived by a notable client, Barry Spanier, and drawn by a notable designer, Jim Antrim. It’s much more interesting than one-design, but it’s expensive—American Magic reported more than 100,000 design hours to produce its. Published on November 26th, 2021 The scow-bowed Revolution 24 is certainly weird, but is it wonderful? This mini-cruiser may look quirky, even extraordinary,. Rupert Holmes December 22, 2022 The Ace 30 is a new design intended to bring the scow bow concept, popular among offshore racing machines, to IRC yachts TAGS: Extraordinary boats monohull Top. Published on July 8th, 2022. Let's just say it has simply languished in the memory hole and, if you were to ask me, a scow bow makes a whole bunch of sense for cruising, too. The scow in particular,. For most racing, this will not do. I believe a flat-bottomed sharpie hull behaves similarly; but that's only conjecture. "Let's open the debate" Ian Lipinski talk's SCOW Bows and the Vendée Globe. Join us for a workshop on how to make your own yew longbow in the. This applies to the stern as well, because the passing water has to be allowed back up to the surface. . Ask the experts: 260. David Raison's scow Mini wins the Proto class in the Transgascogne. She was remarkably dry when heading into a chop - the advantage of the "developed bow" perhaps, and the flam given by the NZScow shape. A scow is a flat-bottomed boat that is similar in design to a barge. I was thinking about building a scow-shaped hull. But also the. The Lombard-designed, hard chine hull combined with a high. So, the more gently this is done, the less drag created. Pitching is aggravated when a conventional bow. In a few days, he will launch his new IMOCA, Charal 2 – this time from the board of Sam Manuard with. 5 is the latest generation series production Classe Mini 6. Thread by: Terje Dahl, Nov. Replies: 1 Views: 6,792. Boat Design Net. The ACE 30 offers a generous foredeck and a carbon bowsprit to accommodate a 100 m² asymmetric spinnaker. The Lombard-designed, hard chine hull combined. Published on September 27th, 2019. ADS. The foiling system provides low drag and minimizes the risk of crashes experienced by most other foiling systems. Body position at center thwart. This mini-cruiser may look quirky, even extraordinary, but wait till you see the space it provides below decks. (2) Heavy displacement with very low immersion rate so can carry a lot of weight. $925. Replies: 1 Views: 6,913. Joined: May 2011 Posts: 517. OC Performance Yacht Brokerage Services P. . Excerpt from article from SA front page ( by Ronnie Simpson: Just days after Davy Beaudart’s prototype Mini Transat 865 Cutisol (aka Scow-bow Mini #2) has launched, it’s sailing in 2nd place in the inaugural “Mini in May” race, a 416-mile race currently taking place off of Brittany. The Melges 15’s stable hull shape and ergonomic cockpit make it a suitable layout for adult racing and educational sailing. The canting keel, twin rudders and retractable bow sprit make it a powerful one-design weapon for windward/leeward, in-shore and coastal racing. In The Realm Of Yachts, The Sun Odyssey 410 Is A True Marvel. They may have missed the mark by not doing electric on this boat. OC's new 2023 scow design (graphic at bottom of this page) is a another product of 'out of the box' and innovative thinking that's been a feature of each of the six generations of. Sometimes designers use hull appendages like rudders, trim tabs or even a bulbous bow. It combines extreme speeds with an element of danger and is thought by many to be one of the biggest spectacles in. The bigger one broadside on could be "Rimu" with single topmast only on main, bluff bows and plumb stem. While the latest foiling Protos in the Classe Mini (the “flying bathtubs”) are fully flat-bowed, Class40 has two max beam limits just short of the bow to prevent this. Dec 17, 2020. Shop a full range of M16 Scow sailboat Parts, Sails & Equipment at MAURIPRO Sailing Store. Additional Features Include: Glide Rite Trailer, Dual Bilge Boards, Main Sail. This is the naval architect’s term for the more commonly known ‘horizontal bow angle at the waterline’. The first occurred in Australia in 1928 when Len Morris built a cat rigged (single sail) flat bottomed scow (horizontal bow rather than the "normal" vertical bow) to sail on Andersons' Inlet at Inverloch, a seaside resort 130km from Melbourne. Doug Lord Guest. Bolbous Bow design theory. A couple of thoughts. Built between 1973 and 1976 on the banks of the Seine from self-made plans, the boat, christened "Ovum", is first and foremost a story about family. Prepare To Embark On A Voyage Of Classic Jeanneau Styling Blended Seamlessly With Cutting-edge Modernity. The variables of the good-bad behavior Gliding-Surfing Big Waves are: a) High side pressure. An original design by the Melges family in 1956, it. The HAWK (a 3-masted scow) mentioned is not the one restored at Kaipara. Print; Facebook; Twitter; PREVIOUS NEXT-of -images Like this boat? Find out more. CarlosK2 Senior Member. The scale is roughly 6:1 L:W for the main hull for about 4. The scow bow is the result of rule beating not ultimate design. Just looking for an opinion if you think this type of hull would actually sail. Interesting "scow bow" on an old Route de Rhum competitor "Ovum" dsigned, Jun 8, 2018, in forum: Sailboats. Most of the technology and design concepts you find today in the IMOCA class have first been tested (and crash-tested) on a mini. ) A scow diverts the passing water under the hull, instead of around it. I'm trying to go along with the question posted by the OP (in relation to the scow bow Teamwork 747 min 6. When Sailing The New 440 The Bow Stays "up" Into The Wind And Rises. $460,000. Most of the technology and design concepts you find today in the IMOCA class have first been tested (and crash-tested) on a mini. 1 Engines. Then I taped the stern transom to the hull bottom. In the scows the bow instead of cutting through the water will stay high on it. About the author. A chine in boat design is a sharp change in angle in the cross section of a hull. Added-on foils and other appendages are usually an indication of poor design. . Published on November 26th, 2021. Plumb Bow. Here at Hoofers, the Scow Fleet consists of a number of E-scows, C-scows and MC-Scows. 3) Provides a crash barrier, thus protecting the integrity of the hull. Front range. A vertical, or unraked bow having a straight edge is known as a plumb bow. Home Tags > bow. Re: scow plans. Bolger (December 3, 1927 – May 24, 2009) was a prolific American boat designer, who was born and lived in Gloucester, Massachusetts. Discussion in 'Sailboats' started by dskira, Aug 9, 2009. Design & build: Pogo Structures. It is unlikely that anybody can define the design in the video but perhaps there are a few people that can help me to find a good scow design. The line where the hull meets the water surface is called the. which has a v-section throughout the length of the vessel, a padded v-hull has a v-section at the bows and the forward part of the keel which then segues into a flat area typically 0. Hull: ~14 ft long, flat bottom rounded bilge scow shape with a slight point forming at the bow before sweeping up into the flat, round scow bow shape. . Melges 14 Gold Options. A scow is a type of flat-bottomed boat with a rectangular shape and a blunt bow, often used for transporting bulk material such as sand, gravel, or refuse. Smith, Harris - Lalkawilas (1942 - 2005) Late Harris Smith, Lalkawilas (1942-2005), was a member of the Kwakwaka’wakw First Nations, originating from Oweekeno Village,. With « Scow » = 0 , i. In the Mini 6. The hull is a scow design with a raised counter, vertical transom; dual spade-type rudders controlled by dual tillers and dual retractable centerboards. Replies: 1 Views: 6,794. LHCER. “In terms of design choices,. ketch rigged hold scow built Auckland 1902 by Geo. Definition of SCOW in the Definitions. This applies to the stern as well, because the passing water has to be allowed back up to the surface. Discussion in 'Sailboats' started by dskira, Aug 9, 2009. The boat has been designed by Frenchman Etienne Bertrand in 2017, entering that year´s edition of the Mini Transat race as a prototype, finishing off at an impressive second place. Today's Posts; Member List; Calendar; Forum; Designs / Plans; The WoodenBoat Forum is sponsored by WoodenBoat Publications, publisher of WoodenBoat magazine. Share: Author: Sandy Parks View all posts by Sandy Parks Post navigation. Translator . S. So, in order to win most upwind/downwind races, the scow bow must be fast enough downwind to make up for its deficits upwind. Dolfiman Jun 10, 2018. My extensive research suggests that bulbous bows have many advantages, including; 1) Increases the Prismatic Coefficient. B. Length 28ft Beam 9ft 10in Gaff Schooner w/two masts + a jib George Buehler Rufus Straight sides, deep raking bow, transom, shallow rocker. Call Us: 260. If the wind shifts left of average, port tack is lifted. Much more about the boat earlier in this thread. Gonzo. Classic Jeanneau styling in an extremely modern yacht. She is a scow bow design, optimised and focused on providing a platform to win the Route du Rhum and THE RACE AROUND. Also. No backstay, no complex foil. Personally i think it was a motor-yacht hull that the used as a mold for the fiberglass hull of this sailboat. Approx. Home Boat Design Forums > Design > Sailboats > Scow 450 Pocket Cruiser. Anyway, I’ve sailed a Y flyer and an E scow some on Lk Washington, which, because of the floating bridges, develops a 3-5’ chop in 12k, and the problem with the scows wasn’t so much slamming into head seas ( the heeled slender bow took care of that) as cross waves slamming into the length of the heeled flat bottom, knocking the bow. The RazMoth design is on it's second iteration. . When one of the most accomplished Mini6. The best thing is that we have images for all of that! Images 480. catamaran. The Melges MC is one of the largest, most popular one-design fleets in North America. From classic bow to scow. The boat displays latest downwind running. Sail out to sidestay. Joined: Feb 2017. sail. gonzo, Aug 25, 2013. Interesting Doug any further word on this design? The scow concept is at it's core a extremely low drag one, in displacement mode and in planeing mode, to generate lift with a curved foil will also generate drag. ALBATROSS reg. About the author. Copa America 2021; Euro 2020; Concacaf Gold Cup; 2021 African Cup of NationsInteresting "scow bow" on an old Route de Rhum competitor "Ovum" Ovum (which I believe means "egg" in Latin) is an interesting design by Joris de Carlan from the 1970's that raced in the 2010 Route de Rhum (I think). The first occurred in Australia in 1928 when Len Morris built a cat rigged (single sail) flat bottomed scow (horizontal bow rather than the "normal" vertical bow) to sail on Andersons' Inlet at Inverloch, a seaside resort 130km from Melbourne. Owen Clarke, working with Peter Hobson Design (PHD) and PURE Engineering have come up with the fastest, most versatile Class40 drawn to date. O. Basic Bow Making in the French Tradition. The latest hot trend in ocean racing design is the scow bow. Interesting "scow bow" on an old Route de Rhum competitor "Ovum" dsigned, Jun 8, 2018, in forum: Sailboats. A scow is double-ended in profile view rather than in plan view. About 4 bulkheads, 1 at each end of the cockpit and two more under the forward deck. Get out of the sun for the afternoon. The smallest sailing scows were sloop-rigged (making them technically a scow sloop), but were otherwise similar in design. The Forum is a free service, and much like the "free" content on Public Radio, we hope you will support WoodenBoat by subscribing to this fabulous magazine. In the alphabet soup of Scow racing, C's, X's, M's, and E's all have their attributes, but the A-Scow has always reigned as the place where the big boys take their big toys and put their big egos on the line. Niccol dim.